Achickwitbeatz presents ⁠the Instrumental Intel podcast⁠, bringing you information instrumental to your artistic career including music industry news & tips, insights & interviews, and beats for your inspiration. Listen on Saturdays at 7 pm EST on ⁠⁠⁠Grander Radio⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠Achickwitbeatz.com⁠⁠⁠.
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Instrumental Intel Podcast

Achickwitbeatz brings you information instrumental to your artistic career including music industry news, insights, interviews, and beats for your inspiration. Listen on Saturdays at 7 pm ET on ⁠⁠⁠Grander Radio,⁠⁠⁠ Achickwitbeatz.com⁠⁠⁠, and your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript Generated by Riverside

00:00
Hey, thank you so much for tuning in to Instrumental Intel. I am your host, music producer, Achickwitbeatz. And today's episode is still continuing to celebrate Hip Hop History Month. We're gonna talk about Hip Hop history in the making because there are people still building the culture right now. So I'm going to highlight some conversations that I've had with Plaay Tha Renegade, Shaan. So I'm excited to be bringing this episode to you. And before I go ahead and get started, of course, I've got to give a shout out to my home station, Grand Radio out of Grand Rapids, Michigan. And with that,

00:29
Let's go. Hey, I'm Achickwitbeatz, multi-genre music producer and strategist to indie artists and labels. Visit achickwitbeatz.com for resources for artists and instrumentals in various genres available for songs, vlogs, blogs, podcasts, themes, TV, film, commercials, and more. Once again, that's achickwitbeatz.com. That's A-C-H-I-C-K-W-I-T-B-E-A-T-Z.com. Let's make something happen.

01:00
I have in the virtual building with me, Plaay Tha Renegade. It's been a long time since we've done an interview. Just in case you've been listening for a long time, we had him on the Music Morals radio show and now he's here to talk about what's been going on in his world. So welcome to the new podcast, instrumental, Plaay Tha Renegade. How you feeling? Oh man, I'm feeling good. I'm feeling good. I appreciate you having me on a new podcast.

01:28
Absolutely. you know, just if you can give us a little bit of background about who you are and how you got involved or kind of pulled into the music business, if you will. OK, well, if you don't know, I bet you I know now I go by Pleasure and Engage, you know, America's favorite stoner, oh owner, co-owner of KRXM radio, you know, also host media, gunboat and co-host, you know, music and conversation.

01:55
Um, just a little bit about me, how I got started in music. I actually been doing music. Well, I should say I fell in love with music. I should say per se when I, since I was 10 years old, I knew since I was 10, I wanted to do music and be in the music industry. Like some of the people I've been looking up to was DJ Quik and it's funny Bow Wow, uh Gucci, Biggie, Pop, Snoop.

02:18
Cube, Drake, so it was just like a mixture of like a lot of different people that influenced me to even want to do this music, they should give me the confidence to do this and just have fun with it. So, you know, yeah, that's pretty much me to that. like I've been doing music for a bit. I've been doing music like at least professionally for like a few years, taking it seriously, actually getting out there, putting myself out there, doing shows, talking music and stuff like that. And yeah, I feel like, you know, the grind is going to pay off soon. uh

02:48
been connecting with a lot of different people, know, been setting up a lot of different events, you know, and just, you know, putting the grind in and putting the work in with this music. Right. That's what's up. So, all right. First of all, I got to kind of backtrack because you named some heavy hitters. And especially to start off with DJ Quik, not a lot of people give him the recognition that he deserves. yeah, I got to salute you right there, man. Oh, yeah, I just feel like.

03:17
Oh, no, no, my bad enough to cut you off. I just feel like quick. He definitely doesn't get the recognition he deserves. He's put so much time and so much sauce into the game. Like any time you hear a lot of these producers and a lot of times we hear some of these rappers, you hear DJ Quik. Yeah, you hear it. And he I feel like he really doesn't get like the recognition. He definitely deserves to be on the Mount Rushmore at least top five. If not top three producers like.

03:44
Or like you feel me rappers because a lot of he produced itself and that is so right I mean like in this little bangs today because he's definitely a part of the most of my playlist man matter of fact I traveled to DC last summer and We were in like the you know how they have like the little lounges for different clubs or whatever we were in there Yeah, I was Corona extra and I was like, know what?

04:13
Did Quik had a song for this? So that was the first thing I put in my story. But yeah, like man, that dude, yeah, most people don't give him the recognition he deserves. But uh yeah, so okay, you shouted out some of your musical influences right off the bat. Are there any more that um you can say that just kind of like, as soon as you heard them, you're like, you know what, this is what I'm meant to do.

04:37
Um, damn, and I don't want to forget nobody and it's hard because I got so many, but I know one that comes off the top of my head, because I was just listening to them like a night ago was method man and red man. And the reason I say method red is because they just have fun with their music. They have fun with their wordplay. They have fun with their style and they style is dope as well. It is. So like that is just so unique and so original, especially how they play off each other.

05:05
Like, Mav could say some cold, ish and then Red come right back in. Just like Kobe and Shaq used to do on the basketball court. And I always feel like Hip Hop is a sport. So it's like, you gotta have the right people around you to make your ish elevate and to make your ish sound good. So you gotta have the right team. Gotta have like, you feel me? Just everything has to be right. Right manager, right team. And the right people in your ear to tell you if your ish sound good or if your ish sound like garbage shoot. Like, that's you, Phoebe.

05:33
And I feel like a lot of time nowadays in the music industry, people don't be honest with each other. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Nobody likes to be honest with each other. Everybody wants to sit there and be like, yeah, that sounds dope, bro. Like, yeah, you going to make it with that instead of just being like, nah, that wasn't it, bro. Be honest with you. your bars was lacking here. Your energy was lacking in the beginning and the middle of the song. Like, and just break it down to him. And I tell people, I don't try to be an outside, but I definitely have an ear for music. Like, I definitely can tell if they're just.

06:02
You me? smile, sure. This is cool. Like, and I tell people the same thing about my music. Like if you don't like it, that's cool. I don't trip. I love all the feedback because that helps me get better in the long run. Yeah. So, well, speaking of which, where do you kind of draw your inspiration? So like, let's say you're sitting down with a beat. What do you have to do to kind of get into the mood to write the way that you write?

06:28
Definitely a rowing up and I definitely and it's funny because I watch movies I watch like old TV shows 90 TV shows and I watch movies and I would draw my inspiration from there and You know just kind of get inspired like that and it's kind of funny too cuz I get inspired by watching certain like old wrestling WWE you be segments and this is smackdown and wrong only only because of the storylines the storylines draw you in like

06:56
Sometimes the acting is us, whatever, but it's entertainment. And that's what Hip Hop is, it's entertainment. So I draw a lot of my inspiration when I'm trying to write and draw inspiration from a song. I just watch a few of those things, I smoke. And I just kind of just get into my element, get into my zone. And I just try to like block everything else out, sit in my car, turn the beat on. I'll probably let the beat play at least five or 10 times before I even write anything down on the pad so I can just have the beat memorized in my head.

07:24
Wow, that's such an interesting process. So you mentioned wrestling in particular. Are there any like particular movies that you kind of go to? Yeah, I'm a huge fan of 90s stuff because I was a 90s kid. Not to date myself too much, but. Nah, I was born in 94. So definitely, I feel you. Like some of the movies I probably saw drew some inspiration from is The Wood, Baby Boy. I would say probably Juice. What else?

07:54
Menace and Society definitely I draw a lot of inspiration from there. Yeah, I saw it three times in the theater. What's that? Goodfellas is another big inspiration. Another one that I kind of draw inspiration from just by how like everything is structured every how they move. Like they just all about getting money and ain't about all that other bullsh- Right. So, you know, I kind of just watch a few of those movies kind of pull inspiration sometimes too or I watch The Godfather.

08:23
and pull a little inspiration from there. And then two, from my 90s sitcoms, they should like that Martin, In the House with LL Cool J. With Keenan and Kel. Just, you feel me? Oh, this should like to get, not to be on no, like, always, you ain't gotta, what's the word I'm looking for? You don't always gotta be tough in your music. Like, you gotta have fun with this shit. Right. Right. Just like what you mentioned with Meth and Red. oh Man, I saw them in Concert.

08:51
And I felt like I was just kind of pulled back to my childhood. Cause I mean, like the energy they had and all that. So yeah, that's, that's really interesting. That kind of explains a lot about your style, which I think is dope. Let me say that right off the bat. Yeah. So is that kind of how you continue with what you do? Cause sometimes people start out one way and they might kind of transition, but you've been consistently dope. yeah, how do you keep that up?

09:19
I appreciate that. I got people in my ear telling me if my sh** is good, if my sh** is bad. And that's all honestly, I'm gonna keep rolling back to that because when you have a yes man team, you'll never get this far in the industry. Maybe, maybe not. Only if you got certain connects. You may have one good hit, but after that, a lot of your sh** just starts sounding the same and repetitive. And that's why I always say DJ Quik is one of my biggest inspirations because you can go back from Quik's first album to his pretty much

09:49
what, Damner, his last one. And you can still hear only a little bit of change, but he's always been consistent with his music because he makes his great music and timeless music. And that's kind of what I want to do. I want to make timeless music. I want to be able to make music where you can hear my shit in 10, 15 years and still sound like that. made that just yesterday. Because you can, because a lot of this you can put on 10 years from now. I'm like, yeah, not again. This just sounds like it was made in 2016 or 2000 2009.

10:18
You're right. Yeah, because I feel like uh some of the music, not all of it, but some of the mainstream music that's out now will sound dated because a lot of people are chasing hits that happened like in the current year instead of building something timeless. And yeah, that's a really that's an important virtue. And thank you so much for uh doing what you do, because, yeah, I mean, there's so many people out there that don't actually recognize.

10:47
everything that you just said. So salute to you for doing what you do. Oh yeah. And I do my research with this music. Plus I'm from the West coast. You know, we, we tend to always try to make sure we're to talk our shit and pop our shit. We got to know what we talking about. Yeah. That's, that's what think about us. We going to pop our shit, but we definitely will have facts and family statistics to back that shit. Right. And you know what? Cause yeah, y'all definitely have a different style that kind of

11:17
I guess I don't want to say dictates everything else, but you know, you know, okay. So I'm from the Midwest for anybody that's listening that might not know, but I mean, man. So of course I was introduced to Hip Hop from the East coast, but man, when y'all started coming up and I'm like, yo, this is a totally different vibe. Like, I mean, it's something that you can't ignore. You can't deny. Like, it's a totally different feeling.

11:44
but it's something that's so authentic about it. So what do you think that is that makes the West Coast pop the way that it does? We just, we just toot our own horn. Like we just, we just us. We set the standard and we set the bar. Hip-hop may have originated in the East and I'm always give up big ups to that. You know, hip-hop did start in the East coast, New York and everything like that. But when the hip-hop took up, when it reached us and it reached the West coast, Dre, EZ, Cube, R &B, all them.

12:13
They took that issue to a whole nother level where everybody's been chasing since then. Yeah, the South has been cool, you know, and I love the South. Shout out to the South, shout out to Texas, shout out to ATL, all them. I love the South. They all got great music and everybody coming out of there. But the West, we just don't never get recognized, which is crazy to me. But we always have, everybody always wants to emulate us. Everybody got to come to the West to do a show, but nobody ever really likes to get a West props where we like where it's due. Like, like on a double XL cover, for example.

12:42
I ain't seen not one West Coast artist. And that's been like that for a few years now. And people like, that shit low-key pisses me off as a West Coast artist, even though I'm still underground and still coming up, it's a lot of mainstream artists that deserve to be on the Freshman XXL cover. From the Zo-O Sama's to the 310 Babies to the Slumlord Shills to the J Worthies, the Baby Stone Gorillaz. It's so like the RJs, like it's so many different people that could have been on that Freshman cover.

13:12
that deserve that ish, but you feel me? They just kind of bypass that ish. But you know, it is what it is. When Kendrick did that movement, they not like us, I tell everybody, like, all eyes on the West this summer. Everybody's looking to see what the West drops this summer. Yeah. Wow. You know what? I didn't even realize that about double XL until you pointed that out. Like, you literally just put me up on game. That's crazy. Because, mean, like I said, even being from the Midwest,

13:41
We had some of everything. So we got the East, South, the West, but yet the movement out of the West Coast is just undeniable. So the fact that they didn't give props like that is bananas to me. I don't understand that. That part. And it's like, it's crazy because the West Coast been having bops for the past few months from Lil' Vada, Lefty Gunplay. Like, come on, man. It's like we've been having hits, but y'all just...

14:06
I just feel like the industry just refuses to recognize the West like that. They just still want to ride the wave of, feel me, how it's been so far with the South and, you know, somewhat the East Coast. But it's like you can't deny telling the West guy. Right. in and we take him back over. We come in and take back over because that's what it was before the 90s, the West and the East. 2000s, the West was still in it. So it's like we, you feel me, I feel like the West is coming back. We definitely coming back and would be familiar with the grudge with the industry.

14:34
Absolutely. Yeah, because I, you know, I actually remember the first time I had to play on Not Like Us when her kid, you're driving again. Like, OK, let's see what's going. And that was my first thought. Like, I felt like I was transported right back to the 90s. Like the vibe, the sound, the way he was rapping, the subject, like everything just felt so dope to me. yeah. So, even if the rest of the world doesn't recognize it, I'm going tell you.

14:58
West at love in the Midwest. So, yeah, we we definitely support y'all over here. Yeah. And that's the crazy part, because we show love to everybody, no matter where we go. Like, we show love because we know when people come out to the West, they love us. But it's just like a lot of these industry heads don't want to acknowledge that. But it's cool, though. You know, we coming out and we coming out and we're going to pop out and show out like and just everybody out there that kept trying to say, Kendrick and Drake battle that

15:27
Drake's bars were better than Kendrick and all that other sh*t. Y'all just don't know real Hip Hop. A lot of these Drake fans really just was over there riding. But yeah, Kendrick really just shut that this down, especially with the not like us video shoot that happened last weekend. Yes. He brought the whole city out. I will forever appreciate him for that. You know, matter of fact, the last episode that I actually have a brother on. oh

15:51
And we were talking about that, like, I mean, like, I've been saying the same stuff about Drake for years and I got labeled as a hater. But thankfully to Kendrick, now that he said it, we were like, oh, yeah, OK, maybe you were right. Thank you. Yeah. I owe a debt of gratitude to him for what he did throughout that entire beef. And then, yeah, what he did with it afterwards, because he could have just like rode into the sunset.

16:19
But to bring everybody together like that, like that's, that's what the culture is about. Yeah. will forever appreciate him for that. And to do a concert out here too, and had the whole West coast out here and then bring everybody on stage with the unity and everything like that. That was dope. Like that was really like real life dope for the city. Like everybody, if you're not from the city, you don't realize how dope that wish was to have everybody on stage like that. Everybody getting along and just vibing out to that. And Kendrick brought that together.

16:47
Yeah. People can say what they want that Drake brought it out of him, but it's like, nah, that's you're talking about. Yeah, right. He started and finished. Yeah, it was already there. He couldn't have like brought it out of him. It was just like I said, you know, sitting back watching same thing that I was feeling. And he just voiced what everybody that actually appreciates Hip Hop culture was feeling. So, yeah. But yeah, I haven't seen any unity like that. Dang, I might be dating myself again, but

17:17
When the Bloods and Crips had that joint tape out to like where one was blue, one was red. on the Wax. Yeah. Bang on the Wax, yeah. Yeah, like yeah, I haven't seen anything like that since then. yeah, yeah, that's, oof, yeah. West Coast don't get enough love. I'ma just say that. We definitely do, but it's all good though. Like everybody that do shout us out and do show us love, man, shout out to y'all and I definitely, you me?

17:44
Like I said, when y'all come out to the West, everybody still show love. It just be these industry heads that don't ever want to give us the props that we deserve. But everybody know what it is. Everybody get their style from the West. Absolutely. Absolutely. So, okay. You know, we talked a little bit about like your own style and how you got into where you are. When you collaborate with people, how do you choose that? How do you select who you actually work with? oh

18:11
I ain't really, and it's crazy because I haven't really worked with too many people, but the people that I do select because I don't know. just, I always got to listen to your music. I got to feel like if it's my music, my brand, your bars got to be up there. I just can't like, you feel me? I can't just put any and everybody on the track because that would be doing me and you a disservice. I love that. Only for the simple fact like I know me. If I know your this is trash and I know

18:41
I can run laps around you in verses, because I feel like I could out rap a lot of muggles. So if I know we got to sit there and write and really go, oh yeah, come on. We can go. Say less. I'm going to embarrass you in the studio because I'm going to make sure my bars are waving and going better. I'm to make sure you know that I'm talking about you in these bars. like, you feel me? Step your pen game up. But real this, though, I feel like how I select people is just, yeah, like I said, you just got to be dope. You got to be dope and you got to fit. You feel me?

19:09
My brand needs got to fit, you know, the song. Yeah, it's OK with you being so authentic. Do you find it challenging to kind of market your music or do you feel like you've kind of found your audience that you don't really have to work that hard at marketing? Oh, no, it's still you for me got to work hard at marketing no matter what. Only for the simple fact like I got told my manager and like I told my team, I don't want to just be known in the West. I don't want to just be known in the South. I want to be known worldwide.

19:38
I want everybody to know me. I want everybody to know my music. I want everybody to know who played a renegade is. So it's like, it's definitely, it's 50 50 is hard and it's easy for the simple fact. Like luckily I do have people in different states that I can kind of contact, you know, so when I do come out there, I can come do different events, different shows. But the hard side is, know, trying to, you know, get everybody into my music somewhat only for the simple fact, like they used to hearing all this boy, this that everybody.

20:07
putting out and sounding the same. So it's like when they do hear something different, they kind of don't know how to take that. Even though they know that this is dope, they still like, damn, okay, but I kind of want to hear this, you feel me, repetitive stab, this repetitive stab, but you feel me, it's still cool though, because I, you know, I do appreciate the fans that I do have that have been with me since day one that do my music and still be, you know, asking when I'm dropping new ish. That's what I do it for.

20:36
because I know it only takes one, literally only takes one. You know, so if you can get one person to vibe with your ish, it's only gonna be a trickle effect. It's gonna be a domino effect. It's gonna be two more, get five more. So that's just all I've been trying to do. Just stay consistent, stay out there all the time. Been trying to do more shows and just keep my face out there. Yeah. Okay, that's what's up. So with everything that you've done, what would you say?

21:05
May have been the most rewarding project or moment in your career so far. oh Oh, I don't think I got there yet. Somebody else just asked me that question when I did a podcast. They're like, what was my biggest achievement? Like, I don't think I got there yet. Like I would say like one good accomplishment I did have was having a West Coast legend, Mitchie Slick, on my podcast a couple of months back and interviewing him. Shout out to the homie Mitchie Slick. That was dope. But I feel like

21:35
I haven't reached that. Yeah, that's proudest, like my biggest, biggest, biggest achievement. Like I don't think I've hit that yet because I'm still trying to, I'm still trying to get there. I'm definitely still trying to get there. Wow. You know what? That says a lot about your grind. I've never had anyone in the history of my radio shows and podcasts. No one's ever said I have yet to achieve that. So, but you know what? It kind of fits like the,

22:03
the essence of your music. Like it feels like you just on this continual grind. And the fact that you feel like you're still trying to reach that pinnacle is just phenomenal. So salute to you for that for sure. I appreciate that. And then I always try to tell people like when you talk to Peder Renegade, you gonna get the authentic me. You gonna get the me that I normally my family is gonna get. So I'm not gonna sugarcoat with nobody. I'm gonna be as authentic and honest as I can be.

22:30
So it's like, yeah, like I hear a lot of these people on certain podcasts try to dig up themselves and say, oh yeah, you know, I've done this, this, this, and this. Bro, I ain't seen you do none of that. I've been following you. I guess we're just, we're just saying any and everything now. Huh? Okay. It is what it is. You got to it till you make it, see. All right. But with me, I'm going to be honest. Like I haven't hit that yet. I'm still trying to get there. And when I get there, people will know it.

22:58
People will know it. Like my grind is going to speak for itself. uh I, I tell people, I'm on a Nipsey Hussle grind right now. So it's like my, my motivation, my, not even my motivation, my hard work and dedication is going to sooner or later. It's definitely going to show. Okay. That's what's up. So, okay. If you could, you know, talk a little bit about your podcast because, you know, people listening to this might not be that familiar. So yeah, what do they need to know? Like when did you get it started? Where can they find it? All that good stuff.

23:27
Almost definitely. we've been taking a break, but we're coming back on Monday. We took maybe a month break, but you can always catch us most of the time every Monday. It's at seven o'clock my time, nine o'clock East Coast time. But it's called Media Gumbo. It's on the Carex platform. We basically, it's like the, we call it the head TMZ. So basically when you come in, we basically just talk about everything going on in the news.

23:56
Sometimes we'll have different artists on there. We'll talk to the artists, you know, get their perspective on it. Then we'll talk about, you know, the artists, just them, how they came and what they got new coming up. And then after that, you know, we get those out the way. We'll just sit there and talk about a lot of these celebrities and a lot of these, you know, current events that may going on in the news. So that's just Media Gumbo on a nutshell. Like we just try to have fun with it. Like when you come to Media Gumbo, we want you to look at it as you come into your homie house or a family cookout to come talk to us. Come have fun and talk to us.

24:25
Right. That's what's up. So yeah. Matter of fact, if people want to follow on social media, where can they find me? They definitely can follow me at PLAAY, THA Renegade, Plaay Tha Renegade. Pretty much anything. Instagram, Facebook, everything. And then if you want to follow them, you can follow me on the other page, you know, follow us at KRXM Radio. You know, KRXM Radio.

24:50
And then, yeah, you can pretty much find all of our stuff and everything that I'm going to be posting in the near future, either on there or on my main page. Okay. All right. So if you could, you know, let us know what's in the works for Play the Ranting Game, what you got coming up, and what we can be looking forward to. So I definitely got a show coming up July 20th. I'm definitely going keep giving you our details and everything like that. I just posted the flyer on my Instagram yesterday.

25:14
So, you know, if y'all in the LA area, California area, make sure y'all pop out, Hollywood's Live 20, and shout out to Underground Live Events. You know, that's the people that's throwing the event. And I'm definitely gonna be coming out with some new music in the coming weeks. You know, it is summertime, so I'm definitely dropping some issues. Might drop one track, or I might go around and say, it might drop two. You know, just stay on the lookout. So, you know, I got a lot of things coming up just from, you the shows, you know, me being about to go to the studio in like the next week.

25:43
and record these songs and about to drop another song within the coming weeks. So yeah, it's just a lot coming up that I want y'all to be on the lookout for. I might even shoot a music video y'all, so you're coming to be on the lookout. All right. So yeah, do you have any advice for any, you know, up and coming artists that might be listening right now? Because, you know, most of the audience is compiled with independent artists. yeah, anybody that's, know, out there, like maybe kind of struggling to find their way.

26:13
You have like one tidbit of advice that they, know, or a nugget that they might be able to kind of latch on to help them in their careers. I got a lot of advice, but we only got a couple minutes. But I'm not like any, any up and coming artists out there, you know, just stick to that. I know it sounds cliche. Stick to that. Don't listen to what anybody say.

26:38
feel good to you and it sound right to you and it make you feel good, put that to show. You never know who's going to touch you. You never know who's going to like that. It's because five people tell you no, 10 people might tell you yes and they like that song. So you never know. So it's just like stay on your grind. Don't worry about it. Anybody tell you, get a good team around you. oh Stay consistent. Just stay, always stay in the loop. Always stay consistent on what's going on in the music industry. Always know your competition in your city.

27:07
Even if you don't like their music, download their music so you know what you gotta upgrade. Why they fans like them. I played a long game and I played a smart game. I played chess, why do you play checkers? That's how you gotta think about it. Yo, that's a serious gym right there. Yeah, that's for real. So, okay, where do you see yourself with music like in the next five years? oh Honestly, it's just up there.

27:36
with a lot of these signed artists and a lot of these well-known artists just still making more music and just being known a lot, maybe at least basically being known out of California. years from now, I see myself being well-known out of California as you feel me, one of them top artists out of California, but I'm I definitely see myself in, you know, doing some movies, doing some acting, you know, in the near future.

28:06
you know, in the next five years, hopefully. And because that's what I want to transition to. Like once I'm doing music, I want to transition to go to 50 Cent route and transition to doing music, doing producing with TV shows and stuff like that. Because that's my other passion right there. I love movies, I love film. Yeah, that's what's up. You know what? I can definitely see that for you. And if there's ever anything that I can do, please let me know. I hope that this is the first instrumental Intel interview that you do and we actually have a series going. So um

28:35
Oh, no. Yeah, I can't wait to have you back if you down. Oh, I'm definitely down. Can't wait. I can't wait to come back. Right. Yeah. I'm like, I'm hoping this is the first part of many. And so, you know, since we're looking at the clock, it's winding down for us. But, you know, if you want to give any particular shout outs or if there's something that you just kind of want to leave the audience with, you can do that at this time. Trying to see, you know, shout out, Karex and I'm ready. I'll shout out to my team.

29:03
I just gotta tell everybody out there, you're up with me, keep the team, know, go on this journey with me, because it's gonna pay off. I'm telling y'all, it's like a I'm like a lottery ticket. Can't miss with me. Love it. All right. So yeah, thank you for your time, for your wisdom and all the gems that you dropped. yeah, can't wait to have you back. Oh man, I appreciate you for having me. Thank you so much for having me on here. I can't wait to come back on the show. This is really dope. Thank you. Until next time.

29:32
Until next time, y'all. I have in the virtual building with me today, like a very prolific artist, Shaan, if you could, you know, first of all, I just want to thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedule to chat with me. And if you could just give everybody a little bit of background as to who you are and how you first got involved with music. OK, first of all, thank you for having me. It's an honor to be on this podcast. And I'm Shaan.

30:02
I was raised in Brooklyn. I've been into music since the age of eight years old. I've been, you know, I've been, come from a music family. um.

30:15
It was just natural for me to capture the interest. And also my stepdad at the time was a musician for the intruders. So I used to watch him play every instrument and I learned by watching him. um I'm self-taught instrumentalist, you can say. Because I play just about every instrument except for like... um

30:44
Any ones that have to do with like saxophone breathing and stuff like that. Not good at those. Wow. Right. Yeah. So, okay. That's really interesting, especially being from Brooklyn. How do you think that that has affected your music? A lot because, you know, this is, you know, being in Brooklyn, New York, everybody was into music. And during the time I was growing up, Hip Hop was very still kind of fairly new.

31:13
But it was like, it was so cultural, it was everywhere. And I naturally took to it because I was a poet. I like poetry and then I like music. So I learned to just started rapping and I have an older sister that was signed. oh She had a big record deal and I used to watch her and I wanted to.

31:39
I used to ask them, beg her, yo, I would like to rap. Can I rap? And you know what they do to you when you're small. They're like, get out of here. I'm not taking you seriously. Man, it used to be funny. And then my other older sisters, they always had rappers at the house when I was living with them at the time. And they had Monie Love would stay there. One of them was best friends with MC Lyte. So I would just run. They have skills when they come because I had an endless crush on MC Lyte. But,

32:07
This between MC Lyte and my older sister that made me want to rap. Okay, that's what's females and people hear that and go, Yeah, that's very rare. Like typically when I ask the question, don't ever, you know, sometimes they might get mentioned, but yeah, that's, that's really. this thing, it was because of my sister MC Lyte, I picked up a pen and wanted to take rap seriously. That's what's up. Who are some of your other influences?

32:34
My other influences was a good friend of mine, Big L. I'm pretty sure you heard of him. Big L. Nice. Oh my God. Um.

32:45
It's so many. Yeah. Most people say Tupac and Biggie, but I was influenced before they came. Right. Right. know, El, El, Master Ace, he's married to my cousin. So I was just surrounded, you know, everybody was doing something, you know, with music. Well, you said like you came up around it and you meant that. You named some some big eh legendary people. So yes.

33:11
Yeah. So, okay. Talk to Master Ace, it's his birthday today. So I got to post him. Well, shout out. Yeah. Yeah. So, okay. You talked about how you started, you liked poetry and then you started rapping. What was it like when you, I guess, recorded your first song? How did that feel for you? I was so hyper. When I did it, right, I had, used to DJ, right? I did all my junior high school parties and high school parties, right?

33:41
Wow. We used to DJ. And I didn't know how to make beats yet. So what I would do, I would take all the instrumentals on the record. You know, one side used to have the song and then they had the instrument on the side. Yeah. I recorded my first demo in my house using other people's beats. And I came up with my own creative songs. And to hear myself was like, what? I did a song and you put it on tape. You're your friends here, they're like, what?

34:09
They hyping you up. Yeah. then when other DJs in Harlem would do mix tapes, they would ask me to rap on them. And that's when I was like, oh, yeah, they asked me, I must have something. You know, so I just started rapping and all the way through college, I was doing it. um And I just did it. And here we are.

34:38
Hey, wow. That's incredible. And I remember exactly what you're talking about with instrumentals. That's part of the reason why most of my CD collection, I mean, I would buy full CDs, but if there was, you remember like those maxi singles, where you have the acapella. acapella and the instrumental, yup. Yeah, yeah. So many, just because of that. And yeah, at that time I had no idea that I was going to be a producer, but that was really a reason why.

35:07
You know, I like to kind of imagine what I could do on it. But yeah, yeah, I feel you there. Yup. You thought listening to things and hearing ideas and you're like, oh, if I know how to make beats, I would try this. Right. know? Right. And I think studying it like that kind of showed me what the structure was. Like noticing the hook might have a little something extra in the background or, you know, but yeah. So, okay. Yeah. That was an incredible era. Well, yeah, it was.

35:37
Yeah. So, So from that point to releasing your first project, can you kind of walk us through that and how you got started with that? Wow. I had my first project. I did was an album called Encyclopedia in 1993. I did a full album and I made some beats off the small, I don't know if you remember the Royce beat machine, the Dr. Rhythm. Oh my God. I made beats on it. Most of it was samples.

36:05
I did the psychopedia with eight songs. And once I got feedback from the I knew I really wanted to do it seriously. So even with everything else I was doing, I always wanted to do the music. And at that time I was OK. So my first record deal, I was offered a deal at Priority Records. I was the only person from New York or even the East Coast

36:35
Um, so I'll most be fine with them. Yeah. Yeah. Um, this was 19, this was in 1996. Um, when this happened, okay. Right before I was going to the military, they, never went through. They didn't want any East coast people on it at the time. It thought it would be a conflict. So after that, uh, I was going to sign with cold chilling.

37:06
Coach Hillen was Kooji Rap, MC Chan, Big Daddy Kane, Master Ace, all of those guys, old Juice Crew. I was gonna sign with them because the person that owned the label, which was Tyrone, was my dad's best friend. And my dad let him hear my demo. He was very interested. I met with him a couple of times. They even got me on their website. oh But what happened was they went bankrupt.

37:34
A lot the artists started doing their own solo things that different and they ended up going bankrupt. They tried to find artists and to get it back, but they couldn't upfront money for them. So that's how that happened. Man. So you had two like really close calls like that. How did you manage to just keep going after that? Cause a lot of times people, you know, running the setbacks like that and then they just kind of give up. How are you able to stick with it and stay determined?

38:04
To be honest, I thought that it would be easier for me to get a deal even with those two because I was surrounded with everyone. Like I told you, my two twin sisters, they was heavy in the industry. Like they was at every party. And I said, once I could get them to take me seriously, they probably will help. But they didn't, you know, and I'm not mad because they didn't take me seriously. And, um,

38:31
Not just that, but my dad is heavy in the film industry, so I was like, we'll find somebody. Then to get to the point, I did another mixtape and it was an independent record label. They signed me. They signed me. I did the album called The Virus, 2003, with them. It was really good.

38:58
And I was supposed to do a whole song with making a band at the time, because they were just doing that. uh And I was in the studio with dads. And she had a question on me, and I didn't want to talk to her. Thank you. Yes, I didn't want to talk to her, because I wasn't interested at the time with being bothered with that. I just focused on the music. And that left a bad taste in her mouth at the time. But we're very cool now.

39:26
So, you know, but the label I signed with, they was just doing the wrong things with the money instead of putting it on a project like they planned to. They was buying all these cars and stuff with them and clothes for me and stuff like that and going to steak dinners all the time. But I'm like, no money is being put away to my project. And I just got frustrated and just left them alone.

39:54
Yeah, I that's supposed to be like the whole purpose of the label. This is the whole point. Right? we spending all this money doing dumb stuff. How are going to promote me? they, once I mentioned it, they put all these things around Brooklyn and Harlem. have like about 50,000 flyers all over the place. And I was performing at a place called The Ark. It was a big famous, big place, really known for Caribbean music. Okay. But

40:23
They started doing Hip Hop nights and I will perform there. And once the owner saw me perform there and the reaction from the crowd, he was interested. He started putting the money up for me. But the problem was the same group of people wasn't doing the right thing. Wasn't doing the right thing. So that's where it is. And I decided I didn't want to be time with nobody else from there. I said I would just do my own mixtapes.

40:52
And I started selling them from my car in the neighborhood. My cousins, you we started printing up my albums from there and selling them, five dollars a piece. And sometimes I would give two CDs for five dollars. I went to Kings Dominia. We drove there. It was a big thing going on in Virginia, in Kings Dominia. And I said, we need to advantage of that. So we all drove. We took our cars. I filled up my trunk with CDs and I did not come back to New York with a CD. Wow.

41:22
Mm-hmm. That's what's up. I feel like people don't really take advantage of... Yeah. and stuff like that like they used to. No, that's what I'm saying. Oh, man. It was so much easier. You know, now I see how Master P and all these other guys that was doing an independent sound out, they trumped. Yeah. They were just consistent. And I made a lot of money doing that for those three albums that I did by CD. I made a lot of money. I did earn credit, yeah.

41:50
dedication and then I did passion beyond reason album and I made a lot of money. I paid a hundred dollars to get it printed and I tripled that three times. That's what's up. Only selling them for five dollars. Man, yeah that's what's up. But it was the time when, you know, the young people had money they would have the fun. in college, so they went new music and you know, I was always dressed a certain way. So I looked the part during that time.

42:20
You know, so it's like, oh, let me I want to be the first one. And I started getting the fan base mainly out of town. Mm hmm. Because people will call me my my my information was on the back of the CD, just in case, you know, a label is like, who's this guy? I have my information, email, my space. My space. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of news and then the.

42:49
This is the last time I was gonna be signed. I was gonna sign with Desert Storm with DJ Clu. Yeah, that went sour real quick. um First of all, they said I sounded too much like their artist, which is fabulous at the time. oh Only because during that time I had a witty style. I was very witty, you know? And he was too. So they felt it would be a conflict.

43:16
And I learned that the day that we were actually doing a song together. oh And that didn't go well because Fabulous and Clue had, you know, some internal things going on and it affected that. his manager wanted me, which I'm very cool with, but he's just, you know, I just didn't agree to the terms, that's all. Yeah. Well, OK, so you've had all these these

43:43
times where you've kind of signed to a label, then you decided to just do it yourself or anybody. Cause most of the people that listen to the podcast are artists themselves in one way, or form. Do you have any advice for anybody? Like as far as oh trying to figure out how to do it independent. Cause you know, a lot of people are still looking for record deals, even though we hear horror story after horror story after horror story. What's one of the biggest, what's that? The advice I would give is to do everything yourself.

44:12
but to find a solid team that's willing to invest in you. Because without the record deal, you're spending a lot of money. You're spending a lot of money. what's sad is...

44:25
If you don't have at least $50,000 to push your music, it's not going anywhere. And it's like, how do I get $50,000, right? As an independent artist, I don't have nobody backing me.

44:40
So you put out all these little projects and you become an influencer and put out a lot of content and build up fans. Let people see you working and see if they're gonna invest in your work ethic. know, especially younger people coming up. um That's how you get it. And a lot of people are doing illegal things to get in, but I would never tell them to do that. Why would you risk it all? Yeah, which you're trying to dream. Why would you risk?

45:09
your dream doing something that's not right, right? Right. Yeah. mean, what we just saw. have to be honest. Yes. I have to be honest about the game. It's set up for people to want deals again, because too many independent artists found ways to make money without labels. So they don't like it. This is why streaming is.

45:31
Basically a waste of time, but it's the only easy way for you to get your music out. So it's a gift and a curse. Right. Yeah. Cause it's very obvious the major labels are trying to squeeze out independence. Oh yeah. They don't like it. That's the reason why they started the streaming. You know, you get half a penny for a stream. If that depends on the platform. That's right. That's right. I was about to say that. Isn't that crazy? It's insane. Calculate half a penny because AI does it for them.

46:01
Right. And that's bananas to me. Yeah. And you got to hit that certain threshold to even get that. To even get it. Yup. So yeah. So it's like.

46:16
Yeah. It's frustrating. m Very frustrating. Okay, so, you know, we talked a little bit about the business side. How about for the creative side? Like when you get ready to even make beats or write or whatever it is that you're doing, what's the part of your creative process? My creative process, if you read the mood I'm in. If I'm not doing nothing at the time and I'm in a happy mood, I'll make a happy beat. I'll make something.

46:44
You know, my beats are designed according to my mood. Most of the time. If I'm not feeling good, instead of cursing somebody out, I go make a hard beat. You know? Yeah. If I feel like I need peace, I will go and probably make something very tranquil type, you know, type of feel or flute, or I may do a uh movie score type of thing. know, I can make any genre.

47:13
because I listen to all types of music. And after I Quincy say, learn every genre, you would be a real producer, not just a beat maker. You see, that's a thing. A lot of people don't necessarily recognize that there is a difference. It is. It is. And I say it a lot. And I don't do it to try to start anything. today is just push the beat button.

47:41
Mouth clicking, mouth clicking, I'll say that. Because we pushed buttons back in the days, right? But mouth clicking, like they're not playing their own drums. Nothing at all. Everything is, let me take that drum from there. Let me take that bass line from there. And I have a beat. You know? It's like, you know, the computer's doing the work with them. Yeah. And I mean, you know, for that kind of cookie cutter.

48:08
I mean, it can serve its purpose. Oh, yeah, you definitely need more. Yeah. Oh, yeah, it does. But, you know, being able to play it, make your own drum clap, right. And you do it by hand is a different feeling. It's more organic, you know, and you're putting your actual work into it. You know, even though that stuff is very convenient, I'm not gonna lie. And sometimes I'll do a piece of those things to add to what I do. Sometimes I'll sit down, I don't know what to play behind us. And then I'll hear

48:38
A sound that is matching it perfectly and I'll do it. But I won't build the whole beat like that. I just won't. Yeah. I'm old school. Yeah. You know You can hear it. Yeah. Your sound is full. know, like you can tell. That's what I try to do. I, um, because I want that feeling of kind of... Beats should be a conversational piece. Yeah. As soon as you hear it, you should know, oh, I could do something about this or this put me in that mood.

49:08
You know? Right. Yeah. To me, that's a beautiful thing. Like to be able to make something that can inspire someone else, even if don't want to write to it, it's a gift. And you know what I'm gonna share with you? What's that? I'm gonna make your beats forever, right? But this is the funny thing. I took 10 years off. Oh, wow. I just started making beats again in January. No way. Yup.

49:36
So everything you can hear... tell at all. A lot of people be like, what? Yeah. know, and I'm like, I'm like, yeah, guys. Because I took a break. I was doing other things. You know, I teach martial arts and, you know, I do so many other different things, right? But my concentration was on that. And I got a little frustrated with the music. But what happened was I had played an old beat for somebody in the car and he was like, yo, music is you.

50:04
No matter how try to stay away from it, it's part of you. He said, even if you don't want to rap, do your own beats. So I started doing it um and sending them out, and people were doing it. So I'm working on so many people's EPs right now. um It's beautiful. And I decided to do oh the EPs, but keep them at five songs. Because it's simple. Yeah. You know what mean? You can get people to do five songs, but you try to do it your whole album or just

50:33
make them a dedicated artist to you, not gonna happen. Especially if you got funds to give them. what you could say, listen, let me produce five songs for you. They're like, oh, that's easy. Some of them could do it in one session, right? Yeah. They're right and then come do it in one session like the young lady I just did. We went to the studio twice. And the only reason why we went twice, because she wanted to make changes on what she did on our recordings. She wanted to clean it up. But her EP is done. We started it.

51:02
and recorded it one day that Friday. She booked a block of hours and we got it done. And me making my own beats made me rap. And I said, let me produce my own album. Wow. I never produced a whole album for myself. I always had other people. And the one I'm working on now is all me, everything. That's what's up. So how do you feel about that? Like, that's got to feel very proud. Like, you know what I mean? Like to be able to... It's very...

51:30
I think it's so dope. I'm very proud because to see the reaction of people and then it'd be like, yo, who did your beats? And they don't know right away. And it's like, wow. I said, I did. Wait, you did these? You wrote everything into the Beats yourself? Yeah. It puts more respect on you. I noticed that. And I didn't have to worry about politics, getting beats from other people. I had people give me beats. And then when I say I'm going to put out this album, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

51:59
You only listen and I'm like, oh, want to really use it. So I was like, you know what? This is what I do. don't I just do it for me? I never really wanted to do my own Beats for Album early on because I know I have a certain sound and I didn't want it to be too repetitive. You know, that's what I was afraid of. But I was like, I'm not going play anything. So just go by the theme. Sometimes I create titles, right? Before I do the song.

52:27
So I would say, Blue Skies. So it's all about, I'm seeing good positive things, right? So I'll make a beat according to that feel of what Blue Skies is. And that's how I ended up making my album fit those different moods and not sound the same. Wow. That's really dope. That's a technique I did. Yeah. I just named like ideas of different songs and put down with the synopsis would be about the song.

52:57
And then I made a beat according to that, that feel. before you know it, I got five different beats that sound nothing like, but my signature tag is on it. You know? Yeah. m That's really dope. I know personally, sometimes it's hard for me to stick with something. Like I might sit down and say, okay, I'm going to make, let's say maybe an R &B beat. The next thing I know is Hip Hop or vice versa. All the time. Yes, we do that because we...

53:24
We think that's what we want to, but when you start touching on things and it becomes something totally different. Yeah. So yeah, I've just said recently on social media, I'm like, yeah, the beats decide what they're to do. So the fact that you can kind of stick with that and then do your thing, I think is really dope. But yeah, I gave up trying to control it a long time ago. Yeah, you have to just go with it. Whatever come in, just flow with it. Yeah. it happens to come out the way you planned, that's even better.

53:54
Right. So yeah, well, I'm excited for, um, to be able to hear a full project. Love what you were saying about working with the EPs and stuff too. Cause, um, I've seen several different surveys where people kind of come back and that's where people are landing like for their attention span a lot. it's really smart, uh, technique that you got going, but yeah, I can't wait to hear the project. Yes.

54:20
2024 is almost wrapped up, out of here. But what you got coming up in the works. So we know you got that project, you're working on some EPs or the other things that the people need to know to be on the lookout for. Well, what they should look out for is my next um film score album. It's called Karmic Justice. It's all orchestrated by me. um lot of it was done with a violin.

54:49
of actual violin and I put it in the MPC to give it, you know, a little digital taste, but still organic. To do my little taste to it. That's what I'm working on right now. It has 21 tracks on here. I'm looking to do it around New Year's, distribute it around New Year's. I mean, it's ready to go now, but I want to really push it because it's a whole different genre from what people are used to me doing.

55:18
Yeah. And hearing from me. But it's just like, like my favorite um film score guy is Hans Zimmer. You heard of Hans Zimmer? Yes. Oh my. Listen to me, girl. Like, I learned, I took the man's master class, everything. Oh, wow. And I play a lot of the instruments that he uses digitally. So I was like, wow. I said, if I can get half as good as him, I'm happy. You know? And I think this one is going to shock a lot of people. And, um.

55:49
And it's all me, no samples and no AI crap and all of this stuff that everybody's doing. like, oh my. Yeah. People try to say, let AI make a beat for you. said, then it won't be my beat. Right. And it sounds like AI made the beat. It does. Yo, you can tell. You can honestly tell when AI made something because it has the, it just has that weird sonic sound to it. Yeah. You know, it sounds robotic. Yeah. Yeah, because I know people were really, you know, kind of scared, like once

56:18
started getting attention like, no, you know, now they're going to start using AI beats and they're to stop paying producers. And then when I tried, I wanted to hear what one of those best ones out there. And I was like, yeah, everybody, think our jobs are safe. So like if you actually make good beats out, yeah, there's no, no AI can't substitute that at all. No, can't. That's the thing. It's limited still. And that's a good thing for real creators, know, musicians. Yeah.

56:46
Absolutely. yeah, man, I feel like maybe you give me some besides I'll sit over them. You what we need to talk. I was checking the page out you fire. Thank you. I appreciate that. Absolutely.

57:10
30 minutes just flew by so quick. So I'm hoping that this is just the first of many and then I get to have you back on. But before we actually like close it out, I wanna make sure that everybody knows exactly where they can follow you, you know, where they can find your music, all that good stuff. Also, if you want any shout outs, you can do that now at this time too. Oh, thank you. Well, first of all, shout out to you for having me. It's an honor to be on here. um

57:38
Anytime somebody wants to interview me and learn about me and put me on a platform, I'm super grateful. And also I'm more grateful because I'm actually a fan of your work and been listening to all your recordings. So I'm kind of up to par with what's going on with you. You know, I may not have said anything, but I would say it now. So thank you. And you're dope. I just want to tell everybody to keep doing what they do. um Be themselves doing it all the time.

58:07
Don't sacrifice you for anything. Shout out to Hilltop Coalition. Shout out to the best manager I've ever had and will only have, Toni Styles. That's my heart. She has my back and has done a great amount of work in a short amount of time and has took me to another level already. So I have to recognize that. And all the fans and anyone who has helped me.

58:37
Thank you. And, um, you can find me on IG authentic underscore Shaan spelled S H A A N. Yes. It's spelled weird. It's spelled different. It's unique. I love it now. When I was a kid, didn't. Yeah. So just hit me on IG authentic underscore Shaan. And you can look up Tony styles. My manager is T O N I underscore styles expelled exactly how it sounds.

59:07
S-T-Y-L-E-S. So yeah, thank you. Really appreciate you coming on, sharing your story and your experience. I firmly believe that as independent artists and stuff, we can learn from each other just by sharing those. So yeah, I want to thank you for dropping those gems. Yes. Yeah, like I said, I hope that we can do this again sometime soon. Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm more than willing.

59:34
Alright, and that's a wrap for this episode of Instrumental Intel. I've been your host, music producer, Achickwitbeatz, and I want to thank you for tuning in. Once again, as always, I appreciate the guests for coming on and sharing their insights. And I'd like to thank my home station, Grander Radio out of Grand Rapids, Michigan. Make sure you come back next week. I got more goodness lined up for you. So, till next time, you know where to find me. Tune in, tell a friend, and I'll see you then. Peace.